Let's Talk some POLITICS up in here - #2

[Mike]

jashley said:

I know this is going to be a shock after some of the posts I have put on this thread. But I don't hate him. I think he might be a good guy to have a beer or smoke a big fatty with. But I HATE what he is doing to this country (and I could do without the smirk).

Are they that stupid? Is it worth it to them to line the pockets of their powerful buddies at the expense of our future?
Peace
j

Jashley,
I'm not correcting you or trying to shape your opinion, just stating my on. I admire your desire to find the good in people but with Dubya, your spinning your wheels! And...he's not "fatty" kind of guy. Strictly the "blow" for Dubya!!!
I have actually known people that grew up with Dubya in Midland. I have watched him through the binoculars many, many times at The Ballpark here in his seat at the end of the dugout. When a player would strike out or make an error I can't even describe the glare and snear he would give them, yet when Palmeiro or Juan Gonzales or someone would smack a homer or something he never once even acknowledged them, and believe me, after the way he treated them they were looking at him. He never met with the players. They were just another business venture (hobby) for him. They hated him as an "owner". He only "owned" less than 10% of the franchise but boy was he the "Bigshot". BTW-he was busy bankrupting (gutting) Harkin Oil & Gas at this same time while he made off with a bundle. A little trick he learned from Uncle Cheney!
Outside his immediate family he only looks to people to see what they can do for him. HE IS A USER!!!

Bush is and has always been a rich, pompous, immature, ruthless brat that makes for a very dangerous "leader" of this country.
He is the rich abusive punk with the fancy sports car who's daddy will bail him out of whatever he gets into that we've all seen in the movies! Who would have ever thought that kid would become our president?
Well...he did.

"Are they that stupid?"
No...but they are that cold and ruthless! Their ass kissers call it "being aggressive".

[jashley]

Hoy Hoy All

Some more great news from Iraq. Ahmad Chalubi is the new oil minister of Iraq (just read about it in Maureen Dowd's column at www.nytimes.com ,it's free) and his nephew is the finance minister. Ahmad, as Jr. calls him, is the guy who we paid millions to lie to us about WMD's in Iraq. He has also been convicted of forgery and is suspected of many other crimes including selling Iraq US military secrects during the war (can you spell double agent). Call me psychic but I knew when he came in second in the recent "election" in Iraq that he would trade his ability to block a new government into a powerful undeserved position. But damn, this guy was better than even I suspected, his family controls the oil and money in the whole country. Is this what 1500+ of our sons and daughters gave their life for? To put a known criminal into a position to steal BILLIONS of dollars and rape an entire country. Related story in the Times, $100 million missing from Iraq. What a surprise .

I do have a confession to make though. I have a terrible crush on Maureen Dowd. Smart, rich, and beautiful; what a combination !!

BillL, Do you still think I see too many conspiricys behind everything? Do you still think our government is above starting a war over money and oil? Gettting more and more obvious don't you think? We miss your opinions. Come out and play .

Scott, We need to hear your dulcet voice too. They are after our libraries in Ohio too. Isn't it amazing that when the government has a money crunch the first thing they go after is the few institutions for the poor. Not to mention the only ones that WORK.

Peace
j

P.S. Mike. You may be right about that whole beer with Jr. thing. The smirk is getting harder and harder to take. When in his speech the other night he bemoaned the lack of a coherent energy plan (after Reagan cancelled Carter's alternative energy program that would probably have us out of our dependence on oil by now) I almost threw up. I must have been in a hippie love everyone mode; I'm over it now .

[Mike]

Chalubi was exiled from Irag for 25 years for convictions of embezzlement, and resided in Europe until the fall of Hussain. I still don't understand why Hussain didn't just kill him. Anyway, he's a Bush/Cheney kind of guy, that's fer sure! This was their original plan with Chalubi to be oil minister and cooperate with splitting up the oil profits. I don't think he will last long; and I'm not talking about because of the election process! I could be wrong tho because he is apparently as good at pulling strings while in hiding as Cheney is.

[Mike]

Texas fun...seriously! ;D

www.kinkyfriedman.com

[BillL]

BillL, Do you still think I see too many conspiricys behind everything?

Yep.

Do you still think our government is above starting a war over money and oil?

No, but I believe I said that, as of late, I would have a hard time believing that either party would do something like that due to the Woodward/Berstien effect that the press (on both sides of aisle) currently employ. Not to mention the Nixon Effect if one tries to cover it up. In my opinion, that was what made the Impeachment of Clinton possible. The actual act was bad enough (not really, but anyway). Trying to cover it up is what got him into hot water. Same with Nixon.

Gettting more and more obvious don't you think?

It depends on what color glasses you're looking through .

We miss your opinions.

Hey, at least someone does. Thanks.

Come out and play .

I'll have to check with my mom. Just remember that I have to be home when the street lights come on. It's very difficult to get into my parents basement after dark ;D

As an aside to all my left-of-center leaning friends in Feat, if you guys spent half the time digging up dirt on the Dems as you do on the right you'd be shocked at what you find. I'm not dismissing , or even disagreeing, with what you've posted. I'm just trying to prove my point (made earlier on the now defunct original thread) that both sides are dirty. Most of those in Washington are in it for themselves and couldn't care less about the general public. They may go in with good intentions but they rarely make it out unchanged/uneffected by the machines currently in place.

Having said all that, I still firmly believe that since my beliefs fall more in line with the Republicans that that is how I should vote. I not going to claim that I wont change my mind at some point, but as of right now I see no one on the left (or the Dems to be more precise) that even indicates to me that they have a better idea (or even any idea) on how to actually fix this broken system.

Since I was told I was bringing politics on the HoyHoy digest and since they don't like that there (only if you disagree with the majority on the list, of course. Anyone else can bring it up as long as myself and the 4 other Reps on HoyHoy don't instigate or reply it appears to be fine.), I thought I should check out to see what you boys have been up to. As always, I see you've been busy

Bill L

[Mike]

BillL said:

Since I was told I was bringing politics on the HoyHoy digest and since they don't like that there (only if you disagree with the majority on the list, of course. Anyone else can bring it up as long as myself and the 4 other Reps on HoyHoy don't instigate or reply it appears to be fine.), I thought I should check out to see what you boys have been up to. As always, I see you've been busy

Bill L

HaHa! ;D They can a little "touchy" over on the HHD. All 5 of em. You better just hang with us.
If they get offended by Poly-tics on this here thread it's their own damn fault.

[BillL]

Mike said:

HaHa! ;D They can a little "touchy" over on the HHD. All 5 of em. You better just hang with us.
If they get offended by Poly-tics on this here thread it's their own damn fault.

The 5 of us aren't the problem. Unless you're talking about the 5 people that start it? Or the 5 people that complain about the topic? Oh well, I'm getting headache just thinking about it. Not to mention that that's 2 wise ass posts from me directed at you in 2 different threads in the last 5 minutes. So, I hearby swear to be my best behaviour at all times (including the digest) from now on. Only serious posts from me from now on. Ahhhhh, who am I kidding? That'll never work. I take that back.

Bill L

<maybe I should run for office; I can lie, switch positions on issues, smile and have my hand in your wallet all at the same time>

[Mike]

BillL said:

Bill L

<maybe I should run for office; I can lie, switch positions on issues, smile and have my hand in your wallet all at the same time>

Now that's just talent! ;D

[chadgumbo]

I would have thought that the money/economics journalists would have been thrilled with the elections of 2000 and 2004, and perhaps they are. Having a Republican president and congress is good for big business, and what's good for big business is what's good for the economy (or so I would think is the prevailing attitude amongst those journalists).

Then again, maybe they're like other types of journalists. Good news (or perceived good news) is really no news at all. Maybe this small band of reporters makes their living the same as regular journalists - with bad news.

Whichever is the case I found the article written by Lou Dobbs in the May 2nd issue of U.S. New & World Report interesting and, for me at least, surprising. He was highly critical of the president's signing into law the new "bankruptcy reform". As Lou reports in the article, "The words compassionate conservatism must now ring hollow for the more than 100 million Americans who make up our middle class... There is nothing compassionate about the president's idea of Social Security reform, the rollback of [healthcare] coverage, or the bankruptcy reform bill." The report also states, "It's ironic that Congress approved the bankruptcy bill to impose fiscal discipline on the middle class when the federal government last year ran up a $412 billion budget deficit and a $617 billion trade deficit."

Mr. Dobbs quotes Harvard Law School Professor, Elizabeth Warren as saying, "Do we run the country for the people, or do we run it for the nameless, faceless banks or international corporations? That was the issue as far back as the Depression. Ultimately, then, the decision was we run it for the people. Now we have a complete turnabout. We not only don't invest in the middle class, we drain away from the middle class. We tax them harder, we leave them with bigger risks like never before in history. And we take away the last shred of a safety net - bankruptcy. It's war on the middle class."

In the same issue, an editorial by Mortimer Zuckerman railing against the elimination of the estate tax says, "How, in the face of our increasingly dire fiscal problems, can Congress even think about giving away so much money to this handful of wealthiest Americans?" It's his position that only a small minority of Amerca's wealthiest people will truly benefit from this new law.

Is it truly war on the middle class, or is Professor Warren going a bit too far? Just the day before yesterday I read on MSN.com that United Airlines has been granted bankruptcy, in which they will now not have to dole out hundreds of millions of dollars in retirement benefits to those who have spent a lifetime endeavoring toward the betterment of that company. Perhaps those retirees will now have to declare bankruptcy themselves... oh that's right, they can't anymore . Only the corporations can do that
I guess they really have declared war on the middle class.
-chadgumbo

[Mike]

chadgumbo said:

I guess they really have declared war on the middle class.
-chadgumbo

Oh, I think I'll hold out for more evidence. ;D
That goes with the same thought process as "I wonder if OJ Simpson was guilty?"

If they think there is nothing you can do about it they don't really have to go to too much trouble to hide the truth.

Their first big lie that I remember:
"Well, Lee Harvey Oswald, a lone assassin, had this 'magic bullett' and......"

[jashley]

Hoy Hoy All,

I have been trying to post, I could log in on the main page but when I went to a thread to post it kicked me right back off. I was beginning to think you guys got tired of my big mouth and had me locked out.

The first thing I have to mention, because it has me so mad, is the recent expansion of the "healthy forest initiative". It's George Orwell time again. Now all, not some, ALL of the remaining wilderness areas in the United States is available to be logged and mined. I think there are 38 million acres of wilderness acres left in the entire United States and the greed heads want it ALL. We have about 1/2 acre of virgin timber left in Ohio and it happens to be near Mansfield in the Mohican State Forest. The only reason we still have it is that it is too steep a ravine to log. This small area is awe inspiring, and I am not exagerating. The trees are not as big as the redwoods Scott has in CA but if you lean against them your arms have almost no angle when you try to put your arms around them, you look up and you can't even come close to seeing the top. If someone tried to cut down these trees for nothing better than greed I believe I would have to follow the example of the Redwood protectors and climb a tree and stay until the loggers went away. I will say again to these thieves in Washington trying to steal our country; SHAME.

BillL, The Woodword/Berstien effect huh. What I see is the greatest attack on a free press I have seen since the Viet Nam War. Coincidence? No one mentioned when Dan Rather used a fake document (unknowingly)on his newscast that the information on that document was all cooborated elsewhere. If I wanted to discredit information that I knew was going to come out anyway, I would put that information on a document that I knew would eventually be found to be faked and put it out myself. Did this happen? I don't know. But if I'm cleaver enough to do this I'm sure that Karl Rove is too.
Now we have a source in the administration for the flushing of a Koran that he leaked (no pun intended) to one of the administrations biggest critics, Newsweek, and then backed out of his statement. Could this have been an attempt to discredit Newsweek? With all of the discussion of this story, no one is discussing if this report was true. Isn't that what is important? Now the administation is attacking PBS. Please go to www.freepress.net and listen to Bill Moyer's speech about this issue. We have had an FCC that has been attempting to sell our airwaves to a very few mutil-billion dollar corporations. Again check out the freepress site on this issue. If you think the so-called liberal media has been hard on Jr please read "Fraud:The Strategy Behind the Bush Lies and Why the Media didn't Tell You" by Paul Waldman. This administration has gotten the biggest pass by the press in our lifetime. Jr's got them itimidated and conned (mostly by his supposed stupidity). If we are not careful the free press will be dead soon. We're not talking about what the Dems do. That has nothing to do with what Jr has done. Old tactic, one Jr. is very good at, but not valid. Both sides are dirty but that has nothing to do with the debate, it's just a dodge. There is also matters of degree, the dems have much to answer for but this admin. is a disaster for our country. You're not paranoid if someone is after you.

Not just Chalubi for Oil Minister but his nephew is minister of finance, is this what we lost (at last count) 1611 American children and 100,000 civilian Iraqi's for?

Do you think Jr's 45% approval rating is why he is now a born again Alternative Energy proponent. Give me a ....ing break, you phony. Reagan as noted above killed Jimmy Carter's alternative energy program 25 years ago that would probably have us out of this oil mess by now. Has Jr given up Reagan as his hero and become a Carter democrat ? Jr's last "Energy Bill" had less than 1% of the funding allocated to alternative energy and $49 billion for oil exploration, great friend of somebody but I don't think it's alternative energy.

I gotta quit getting this p.o.ed, I'm going to have a stroke .

Long live the free press. Long live the freedom of speech and expression.

Peace
j

[Mike]

Accurate friend..accurate.
You must looking through (un) "colored glasses".

[jashley]

Hoy Hoy All,

The forum let me back on. Is anyone else having trouble posting? I get logged on the main page but when I go to a thread I get kicked off again. Am I just a dummy or is anyone else having this problem? I can't even e-mail the webmaster (because I go back to guest status) when this happens, maybe this is something that could be changed so we can report a problem?

Mike, Thank You for your kind words.

BillL, I understand your pain. Chad and I got into a side discussion about the crisis of libraries and what an a**hole Rush is on another thread and someone yelled at us.

I don't know what the rest of you think of Howard Dean's negative comments about the Republicans and neo-cons are but I think their whighning is funny. These idiots have called everyone from Carter to Clinton everything in the book, from incompetent to traitor to drug addict to sex fiend. They even turn on thier own like Jr did in the SC primary in SC when he said that Mc Cain was crazy form being in a North Vietnamese POW camp. No chance of that chicken hawk Jr being in any pow camp. If anyone says anything even remotely negative about them they howl like stuck pigs. "Ohhhh, the democrats are being meeeean to us!!!" I expect to hear them yell for thier mommies. Give me a break. I think it's about time the democrats quit being so damn polite. Here is what I think the dems ought to be calling Jr.; traitor, liar, thief, draft dodger, idiot, constitution trasher, flip-flopper, war criminal, murderer (for profit), polluter, and destroyer of this great country. Plain enough for them. Yes, I wish that politics were more cival but we are long past the time for politeness. And of course, the Repulicans started it .

Thank you all for letting me get this off my chest.

Peace
j

[Mike]

jashley said:

These idiots have called everyone from Carter to Clinton everything in the book, from incompetent to traitor to drug addict to sex fiend. They even turn on thier own like Jr did in the SC primary in SC when he said that Mc Cain was crazy form being in a North Vietnamese POW camp. If anyone says anything even remotely negative about them they howl like stuck pigs. "Ohhhh, the democrats are being meeeean to us!!!"
Peace
j

It's the Grandaddy of double standards. Typical behavior of spoiled brats trying to get way more than what's proper. The most disturbing fact is the complete lack of decency, while they do all of their "preaching", that half of the public is still too stooopid to recognize.

[Realtics]

Can't we all just get along here ?

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