|
Post by Mike on Feb 8, 2006 9:54:08 GMT -5
OK, lets do this Muhammad Cartoon thing. IMO, I never saw better applications for the phrases like: "F*ck em if they can't take a joke!" "They can dish it out but they can't take it!" or maybe this one, "The shit's about to hit the fan!" You can never make a blanket label for any group, but I've always had the feeling that even the "good" muslims are content to sit back and let terrorist do their dirty work for them. Don't trust em, don't particularly like em. I've dealt with many, many Arab businessmen in Dallas. They have no inclination whatsoever for integrity and honesty. I reported one group to the FBI, for all the good that did.
|
|
|
Post by featphoto on Feb 8, 2006 10:36:07 GMT -5
OK, lets do this Muhammad Cartoon thing. IMO, I never saw better applications for the phrases like: "F*ck em if they can't take a joke!" "They can dish it out but they can't take it!" or maybe this one, "The shit's about to hit the fan!" You can never make a blanket label for any group, but I've always had the feeling that even the "good" muslims are content to sit back and let terrorist do their dirty work for them. Don't trust em, don't particularly like em. I've dealt with many, many Arab businessmen in Dallas. They have no inclination whatsoever for integrity and honesty. I reported one group to the FBI, for all the good that did. ironic, isn't it? more than the 9/11 destruction and all the suicide bombings that target civilians (women, children), more than our ill-advised plunge into Iraq and the hip deep shit-hole that's become ... more than anything else, this dust up with the editorial cartoons finally, unmistakably, inarguably illustrates the fundamental difference between the rest of the world and the Muslim world: that being the difference between the 21st century and the 14th century, which seems to be where the fundamentalist Muslims are stuck. maybe, just maybe, we'll all finally get it: the basic differences between the rest of the world and the Muslim world are so profound that: we will never be friends and at best can only hope for a distanced tolerance for each other. I think distanced is the key word ... no one in their right mind intentionally hangs around someone else who daily talks about how they want to kill you, yet we are forced into constant close contact with the Middle East because of oil ... if Bush's lip service to reducing our oil "addiction" sees any reality it will make our world a safer place by keeping us the Hell away from the Saudis, Iranians, Iraqis and anyone else from that twisted part of the world. as we lose the last of our early/mid 20th century dominance over manufacturing to the cheap labor parts of the world, we really are left with research & cutting edge technology as our principle product (that and agriculture; talk about two ends of the spectrum) ... if we truly set our minds to developing alternate sources of energy to power our cars and heat our homes we can succeed, and then turn our backs on the sheiks & mullahs and have them begging us for the luxuries & technology they've become so addicted to ... now, wouldn't that be a great thing to see?
|
|
|
Post by Mike on Feb 8, 2006 12:02:37 GMT -5
This Government has an endless supply of stupid gall!!! I guess they could LITERALLY charge "an arm and a leg" and have no problem with it! ASSHOLES!!!!!!! "...if there's any truth to it." And they wonder why they're having problems with recruitment. Sure doesn't make me want my 2 sons to "volunteer". Army blasted over soldier’s body armor Sympathizers raise nearly $6,000 to repay Army for missing item By Eric Eyre Staff writer
West Virginia’s two U.S. senators asked top military leaders Tuesday to explain why 1st Lt. William “Eddie” Rebrook IV had to reimburse the U.S. Army $700 last week for body armor and other gear damaged after he was seriously wounded by a roadside bomb in Iraq.
More than 200 people —from West Virginia and across the country — donated more than $5,700 to Rebrook after reading about his body armor payment to the Army.
Rebrook, 25, who was medically discharged from an army base in Fort Hood, Texas, last week, said he wouldn’t keep the donations. He’s passing along the money to charity and a Louisiana woman who lost her home in Hurricane Katrina. He said the woman’s son helped save his life in Iraq.
Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va., sent a letter to Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld Tuesday, demanding that the Army refund Rebrook’s money immediately.
“I was outraged this morning when I read the story about what happened to Eddie,” said Rockefeller, who nominated Rebrook for admission to the U.S. Military Academy in West Point, N.Y., when Rebrook attended George Washington High School in Charleston. “I’m heartbroken that he can’t continue his career, and I’m shocked that he has been treated this way by our military.”
At a U.S. Senate hearing Tuesday, Sen. Robert Byrd, D-W.Va., asked why Rebrook was forced to pay for body armor damaged when he was wounded in Iraq.
“How can it be that the Army is charging wounded soldiers for replacing damaged body armor? Is this standard practice?” Byrd asked during a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing on the Department of Defense’s 2007 budget.
Rumsfeld and Gen. Peter Schoomaker, the Army’s chief of staff, attended the hearing.
“That is a very unusual story,” Schoomaker responded. “I have no idea why we would ever do something like that. We have issued body armor, the very best that exists in the world. Every soldier has it.
“We certainly have procedures that account for battle loss, and I just find it a highly unusual story. But we’ll certainly follow up and correct it if there’s any truth to it.”
|
|
|
Post by chadgumbo on Feb 8, 2006 12:23:44 GMT -5
From Featphoto earlier today:
Hank, very well said. Concise, accurate, and possibly the best single paragraph written on the politics page to date.
|
|
|
Post by Scott Hays on Feb 8, 2006 14:13:13 GMT -5
more than the 9/11 destruction and all the suicide bombings that target civilians (women, children), more than our ill-advised plunge into Iraq and the hip deep shit-hole that's become ... more than anything else, this dust up with the editorial cartoons finally, unmistakably, inarguably illustrates the fundamental difference between the rest of the world and the Muslim world: that being the difference between the 21st century and the 14th century, which seems to be where the fundamentalist Muslims are stuck. Let me second Chad's observation ... ... and then add a couple of disclaimers. While depictions of Mohammad are expressly forbidden in Islamic faith (think of some of the overtly hostile reactions some Americans have for burning the flag), religious offensiveness or intolerance or lack of understanding (or whatever) is not what the violence is about. Nor does it excuse the violence (nothing excuses violent action, in my opinion). No, it is, quite simply, an expression of anti-Western feeling. The bitterness goes all the way back to the 12th century (not the 14th), when Christians launched a vicious and unprovoked surprise attack on Jerusalem. This is not finger-pointing or blame-gaming; it's just what happened ... viciousness, intolerance, mindless atrocities and the rest have been waged by everyone against everyone else (throw Zionism into the mix here, as well). Always the optimist, I think there is a hope for the future ... but it will require a lot of hard work, and most people find it easier to not change and to always blame someone else for their condition. Some of you may know of Joseph Campbell (deceased), best remembered in the 1988 PBS Series "The Power of Myth" (or that his work inspired George Lucas to write "Star Wars"). He argues that all three of the great monotheistic religions were born from the same part of the world, by essentially the same people, who shared the same basic world view. Each religion has, at its core, the same essential principles. But, since each arose at a different time, the temporal aspects of religious expression are different ... that is, how followers practice and interpret the core values in their daily lives, expressions and actions are different. Additionally, all three religions arose at a time when there weren't practically any other types of believers (or beliefs) affecting them ... they were essentially isolated for long periods of time and, though in contact with people from other parts of the world, the contact was transitory and not permanent. The significance of this fact is what helps us understand how increasing contact with people outside the belief system further changes the temporal expressions of faith. In short ... Judaism, Christianity, and Islam -- while not identical -- are very similar to each other and are expressions of similar mythologies and collective views of the world. They are different in the way those beliefs are enacted in the real world ... subject to political, economic, social and ideological tensions, pressures, competitions and the like. More importantly, people are locked into those expressions until someone comes along and reunites them. Believe it or not, there was a time when people of all three faiths coexisted relatively well. Jews, for example, were welcomed to live and work in southern Spain and in the Middle East ... especially those refugees from Christian pogroms and inquisitions (there are some pretty nasty historical reasons for Christians and Jews to mistrust one another, as well). Christian traders and pilgrims were welcome to the Holy Land prior to 1200. If Christians and Jews chose not to convert to Islam (and they had a choice), they were taxed a higher rate than Moslems, but -- according to Mohammad -- they were "people of the Book" and to be treated as spiritual brothers. Historically, then, there is a record of coexistence. It can ... and probably will ... return when someone (or some event) provides a new set of symbols and/or myths to return to the fundamental core that all three religions share. But I'm not holding my breath for it to happen.
|
|
mg
Full Member
Posts: 117
|
Post by mg on Feb 9, 2006 11:16:57 GMT -5
I specialized in Middle Eastern history at UT and was blessed with many excellent professors there. You have written exactly what i learned there, scott. mg
|
|
|
Post by Scott Hays on Feb 9, 2006 11:39:17 GMT -5
Thanks for the affirmation, Melissa! But now, to switch gears (again), remember that I am interested in documenting the Bush Administration's manipulation of science, data, and even scientists in order to support its 19th century political and economic world view? Just a few posts ago, I pointed out an event that may (or may not) be receiving national attention -- the efforts to quash a scientific study which concludes that salvage logging after fires retards the growth of new forest -- that seemed to have been resolved within the science community with everyone agreeing that science needed to proceed as planned, and efforts to circumvent the dialogue and review process through censorship or threats were not the best of all possible approaches, until the BLM announced it was withholding remaining funding for the grant under which that particular study was conducted. Now ... a United States Congressman from Washington, and a U.S. Senator from Oregon (a Republican, at that) are demanding an investigation into the propriety of the BLM action -- is it warranted? Or is it heavy-handed retribution? And no sooner did I begin this post, than the following editorial appeared in today's (2/9) Washington Post. I include the url, but also the text of the editorial: www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/02/08/AR2006020801991.htmlThe Politics of Science Thursday, February 9, 2006; Page A22
IT IS A RARE thing for the biography of a 24-year-old NASA spokesman to attract the attention of the national media. But that is what happened this week when George C. Deutsch tendered his resignation. Mr. Deutsch had, it emerged, lied about his (nonexistent) undergraduate degree from Texas A&M University. Far more important, several New York Times articles over the past week or so have exposed Mr. Deutsch as one of several White House-appointed public affairs officers at the agency who tried to prevent senior NASA career scientists from speaking and writing freely, especially when their views on the realities of climate change differed from those of the White House.
Mr. Deutsch prevented reporters from interviewing James E. Hansen, the leading climate scientist at NASA, telling colleagues he was doing so because his job was to "make the president look good." Mr. Deutsch also instructed another NASA scientist to add the word "theory" after every written mention of the Big Bang, on the grounds that the accepted scientific explanation of the origins of the universe "is an opinion" and that NASA should not discount the possibility of "intelligent design by a creator."
The spectacle of a young political appointee with no college degree exerting crude political control over senior government scientists and civil servants with many decades of experience is deeply disturbing. More disturbing is the fact that Mr. Deutsch's attempts to manipulate science and scientists, although unusually blatant, were not unique. Just before Christmas, the federal Environmental Protection Agency issued "talking points" to local environmental agencies. These suggestions were intended to help their spokesmen play down an Associated Press story that -- using the EPA's own data -- showed that impoverished neighborhoods had higher levels of air pollution.
At the Food and Drug Administration, the director of the Office of Women's Health recently resigned because she believed that the administration was twisting science to stall approval of over-the-counter emergency contraception. Off the record -- because they fear losing their jobs -- some scientists at the Department of Health and Human Services say that Bush administration public affairs officers screen their appearances and utterances more carefully than anyone ever did. Scientists at places such as the Agriculture Department, not a part of the government known for its publicity hounds, have made the same claim.
In every administration there will be spokesmen and public affairs officers who try to spin the news to make the president look good. But this administration is trying to spin scientific data and muzzle scientists toward that end. NASA's Mr. Hansen was right when he told the Times that Mr. Deutsch was only a bit player. "The problem is much broader and much deeper and it goes across agencies," he said. We agree.
|
|
|
Post by featphoto on Feb 9, 2006 13:33:39 GMT -5
Historically, then, there is a record of coexistence. It can ... and probably will ... return when someone (or some event) provides a new set of symbols and/or myths to return to the fundamental core that all three religions share. I wonder if this unifying event of which you speak isn't the coming of a Messiah-like figure (I believe all 3 religions have that as part of their mythos, do they not?) ... problem is, the atmosphere/culture/level of world sophistication that allowed these mythologies to be established and the tenets to be forged and then integrated into the people's cosmological view existed a couple of thousand years ago (+-). given the secular nature of the 21st century world, I think the peoples involved have too jaded a world view to permit a "miracle" to come along. it's the old, "if Jesus were alive today he'd either be locked up or ignored" argument I guess ... in essence, they're fighting a battle today that's demanded by standards that were created a thousand or more years ago ... another example of mankind's technical abilities advancing way faster than our ability to handle it.
|
|
phils
New Member
Posts: 7
|
Post by phils on Feb 9, 2006 17:47:45 GMT -5
Hey, I'm sick of all ...what's going on right now in world and national politics, that is. Good posts by the way. I've always been a Dem. .can't help it. .it's a family thing. I don't get into the political threads that much...livin' here in the DC area, I get too overwhelmed with it. I get bored at work and sometimes look at political blogs. Don't know if anyone here reads 'em or not, blogs that is, ( they're kind of like watching paint dry sometimes), but...... ( sorry Hank R., another "plug" coming up here for someone, no pun indended).... one of my favorite writers is an odd-man-out by the name of Andrew Sullivan. If you don't know who he is..well...Andrew is gay, conservative, Catholic, and hated by all three groups. Gotta love that. He's no wimp. His blog is now on Time.com. Being the opposite of everything he is, I still like the guy. He tells it like it is. He's no fan of this administration. I used to write into his blog a lot, so I took the time go to meet him after he did a speech up in Philadelphia a while back. He's funny as shit..nice guy. As a matter of fact, I did my duty and gave him a copy of LF's CD "Live in St. Louis" when I met him. I ask him not to write back, out of respect for his time, but maybe I turned him into a Feat-head. Who knows. Either you like the guy or you hate him..no in between..and he could give a rat's ass if ya do or not. He has a lot to say on everything political, and he's not afraid to rattle feathers, which he does quite often. Check him out : www.time.com
|
|
|
Post by Scott Hays on Feb 10, 2006 12:43:57 GMT -5
I wonder if this unifying event of which you speak isn't the coming of a Messiah-like figure (I believe all 3 religions have that as part of their mythos, do they not?) ... problem is, the atmosphere/culture/level of world sophistication that allowed these mythologies to be established and the tenets to be forged and then integrated into the people's cosmological view existed a couple of thousand years ago (+-). given the secular nature of the 21st century world, I think the peoples involved have too jaded a world view to permit a "miracle" to come along. it's the old, "if Jesus were alive today he'd either be locked up or ignored" argument I guess ... in essence, they're fighting a battle today that's demanded by standards that were created a thousand or more years ago ... another example of mankind's technical abilities advancing way faster than our ability to handle it. If mythology, and myth-making, were dead today, then I would probably agree with you, Hank. But it's not. New myths are being spun all the time, and we are so caught up in them that we seldom question or challenge their meaning (let alone their veracity). Just the terminology we use reflects that unthinking belief in the "right ways" to live (which is really what mythology does ... it answers the large questions of human connectedness -- to the world, to the universe, to itself -- by providing examples of both the good and the bad examples) -- I mean, just on this list we throw around expressions like "free-market", "freedom", "democracy", "liberal", "conservative" (etc.) without ever questioning or challenging what they really mean; or even if they really exist. The modern world does, indeed, have us fragmented and torn from that internal part of us that desires explanations and answers that satisfy ... for lack of a better term ... the heart, as opposed to explanations that satisfy our minds. Nothing wrong with the intellectual ... we need that, because it helps us organize our thinking and develop tools to make our lives richer, more rewarding, and hopefully more safe and secure. But we also need the connection of the heart to give it all meaning. By the way ... it is never politicians, or economists, or professors (though occasionally they might slip into the mix), or generals, or even mechanics that mix with the stuff that causes or generates myth. It is artists, musicians, poets, storytellers, and even inventors who seem to be in touch with those deeper feelings and emotions that shape our view of the world. The tinkerers and mechanics (those that perform functionary tasks) may be poets, as well, and may help create myth ... but it is only in their role as artists that they create myths, not in their role as a "leader". Therefore, it is a good idea to listen closely to the words of our favorite song-writers, for in them may be concealed the new world view! In the past, meaning was derived from a belief in gods and God. A lot of people still hold those beliefs as central to their being, but their expression of those beliefs -- as you say -- is dictated by the physical world they find themselves in. The Church of today (and I don't really think it matters much which "church" you select -- or even from which of the 3 monotheistic faiths from which you choose) is vastly different from the "church" that inspired the core beliefs around which they are organized. People live in the temporal world, and use anything (including religious belief) to gain advantage. Yes ... all three monotheistic religions have very old roots. The roots, however, are built around very solid, important matters. I suspect they are just as important today as they were then (love, sharing, respect for the natural world, do well to each other, etc.). I didn't really have a "messiah" in mind when I suggested someone (or some event) might rekindle the unity of these core beliefs. I suppose it could happen ... though I am more inclined to believe that someone(s) will attempt to use such a "messiah" to gain leverage and advantage, rather than view the effort for what it is. But that is part of the myth-making process, isn't it?
|
|
|
Post by featphoto on Feb 12, 2006 13:56:19 GMT -5
OK, lets do this Muhammad Cartoon thing. IMO, I never saw better applications for the phrases like: "F*ck em if they can't take a joke!" "They can dish it out but they can't take it!" or maybe this one, "The shit's about to hit the fan!" I've finally had the chance to look at the now-famous cartoons ... if you'd like to see them just send me a private message with your email address and I'll send them to you. I'd post them here, but the file really would be too big to fit in the message board format.
|
|
|
Post by Mike on Feb 12, 2006 14:37:36 GMT -5
Seen em. Other than the reaction of the aforementioned middle eastern zombies it's no big deal to me. The "sparkplug" seems to be the one with Muhammad's turban as a bomb with a fuse coming out of it. Same absurdity as as an American politician saying..."I am not a crook!"
|
|
|
Post by Mike on Feb 12, 2006 16:41:17 GMT -5
Safety tip for the day:[glow=red,2,300]Don't go quail hunting with Dick Cheney.[/glow] Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot and injured a man during a weekend quail hunting trip in Texas, his spokeswoman said Sunday.
Harry Whittington, 78, was "alert and doing fine" after Cheney sprayed him with shotgun pellets on Saturday while the two were hunting at the Armstrong Ranch in south Texas, said property owner Katharine Armstrong. "Fortunately, the vice president has got a lot of medical people around him and so they were right there and probably more cautious than we would have been," she said. "The vice president has got an ambulance on call, so the ambulance came." "...an ambulance on call..." Looks like he does pretty good at managing his own healthcare!
|
|
|
Post by chadgumbo on Feb 13, 2006 12:04:23 GMT -5
As it turns out they weren't actually hunting for the bird, they were hunting the man - Dan Quayle, who successfully escaped into Mexico ;D
|
|
|
Post by featphoto on Feb 13, 2006 14:24:56 GMT -5
As it turns out they weren't actually hunting for the bird, they were hunting the man - Dan Quayle, who successfully escaped into Mexico ;D shouldn't that be Mexicoe?
|
|